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Toyota Prius: Future Tech, plug-ins and electrics

  1. #1
    Tony
    Guest

    Future Tech, plug-ins and electrics

    Several days ago Toyota announced that they are developing plug-in
    hybrids. These are hybrids with larger battery packs. They're
    designed to be plugged into a socket and charged at night, then you can
    drive up to, perhaps, 8 or 10 miles on battery power alone before the
    gasoline motor kicks in. You should get many of the benefits of an
    electric car, but still retain the long range and ability to "fill her
    up" at gas stations during those extended highway trips.

    Some people have already developed conversion kits to make the exsting
    Prius into a plug-in hybrid. It does void your warranty,
    unfortunately. It seems likely that these homebrew kits, plus the
    higher price of gasoline, spurred Toyota to give plug-ins a proper try.

    As with pure electric cars, batteries are the limiting technology. Not
    only are they expensive, but the discharge cycle of an electric car is
    much more demanding on batteries, and they are prone to degrade faster
    than the batteries in a "conventional" hybrid.

    One interesting aspect of this is that it could eventually pave the way
    for fully electric cars. I can imagine future models that move more
    and more work onto the electrical system, with improved battery
    technology, until it becomes practical to jettison the gasoline engine
    completely.

    Now, speaking of electric cars. . . I was floored by the recent
    unveiling of the Tesla Roadster. It's going to be an expensive car and
    very much a toy rather than a practical, economical car -- but what a
    toy! You are looking at 0-60 MPH in 3.7 seconds, upwards of 250 miles
    driving range per charge, and top speed about 135 MPH. It appears that
    battery technology is just beginning to edge over the line of adequacy
    for electric cars. Storage technology (both batteries and
    supercapacitors) is being heavily researched around the world, so it's
    only going to get better.

    I can imagine five or six years from now, electric cars becoming really
    practical. The benefits can be huge. These cars can get energy
    efficiency equivalent to 135 MPG. Mechanically they are very simple:
    no complex engine to repair or keep in tune, no oil changes, no filters
    or hoses, no spark plugs, no exhaust system. They could have a long
    lifespan with very little maintenance. Based on some storage
    technology that's in labs today, it's just possible they might achive
    400-mile range, fast recharge, and much reduced battery degradation
    over time (or practically none, in the case of supercaps).

    We aren't there yet. But I'm beginning to feel optimistic, there's a
    light at the end of the tunnel for electric cars. It's getting close
    enough to think about buying one sometime before I get onto Social
    Security.

    --
    Tony Belding, Hamilton Texas


  2. #2
    Dave
    Guest

    Re: Future Tech, plug-ins and electrics

    Just remember that total electric cars just shift the pollution to the
    power plants, most burying coal or oil.

    Tony Belding wrote: 

  3. #3
    mrv@kluge.net
    Guest

    Re: Future Tech, plug-ins and electrics


    Dave wrote: 

    Depending on the source for electricity in your area, a BEV may or
    maynot put out more greenhouse gas emissions than a 55MPG HEV. Mainly,
    if the primary source for electricity in your area is coal (much of the
    northeast), your HEV is cleaner than a BEV running on coal-powered
    electricity. However, if your electricity source is natural gas, the
    BEV is usually cleaner than the HEV (depending on the method used for
    natural gas->electricity conversion), and it gets even better for the
    BEV if you are using a hydroelectric or other renewable electric
    source. In comparisons with a generic 17MPG SUV, an average 26MPG
    vehicle, and a high-efficiency 38MPG vehicle, the 38MPG vehicle still
    will beat the coal-powered BEV, but isn't as clean as the HEV (and gas
    and renewables powered BEVs are much better than the 38MPG vehicle).

    see: "Battery-Powered Electric and Hybrid Electric Vehicle Projects to
    Reduce Greenhouse Gas Emissions: A Resource Guide for Project
    Development," July 2002
    http://www.netl.doe.gov/products/ccps/pubs/resguide.pdf
    http://www.eere.energy.gov/cleancities/international/pdfs/hev_ev_ghgreductions.pdf
    mainly section 4.3

    (and that's besides the arguements that it's easier to manage emissions
    from a handful of electric plants, as opposed to millions of
    independently-owned cars... typically, electric charging rates are
    still cheaper than petroleum rates, too.)


  4. #4
    Tony
    Guest

    Re: Future Tech, plug-ins and electrics

    On 2006-07-29 08:49:09 -0500, "net" <net> said:
     

    Yeah, you are probably right now that I think of it. Still it's not a
    huge difference -- and 100% coal-generated grid power is really the
    worst case scenario. Even then both cars would be considerably cleaner
    than your average conventional gasoline-powered car.

    Greenhouse gas emissions are not the only factor to look at. Despite
    its efficiency, the hybrid still requires trips to the filling station,
    still requires a fuel that is entering global depletion and is largely
    imported from foreign lands of doubtful friendliness. Peak Oil and
    energy independence are my concerns, moreso than global warming.

    Plus, the Tesla Roadster looks like the most fun car to drive that I
    can imagine. And I have a pretty good imagination.

    --
    Tony Belding, Hamilton Texas



 

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