Toyota Prius: Citeron has a hi bred coming with a diesel that will run the car.

<com> wrote in message
news:googlegroups.com... 

Actually, the 69 mpg (actually 3.4 L/100km) is a rating also, but probably
in an EU cycle. Real world figures always vary as energy requirements of the
passengers vary. I can't tell if A/C is available - most European cars forgo
A/C if they are trying for economy. But that makes them a tough sell in
Phoenix!

Honda hybrids run on the ICE if the battery fails; that form of hybrid is
usually called "parallel." The tradeoff is relatively poor economy in town,
as the ICE has to turn in most parallel systems. There are ways around it,
and maybe Citroen/Peugeot has gone that way.

The Citroen appears to be a "2+2" style; room for two adults and two
children. That's just from the pictures; I didn't see specs yet. Dunno about
the Peugeot sibling.

Anyway, good to see more hybrids entering the market. The momentum is
valuable.


Mike

<com> wrote in message
news:googlegroups.com... 

Ah, it's a concept car. More details at http://tinyurl.com/be824 including
the possible future:
"PSA Peugeot Citroën says that while it could market its Hybride HDi
vehicles as early as 2010, the introduction is dependent upon its ability to
make the technology available at an affordable price.Today, the price gap
between a Hybride HDi model and a comparable diesel HDi model is still too
wide and would have to be halved to make diesel hybrid vehicles accessible
to most consumers."

More interesting concept cars in the Japanese mode:
http://tinyurl.com/y96x8o and http://tinyurl.com/2w379 Those have been
around a while, but they clearly demonstrate how hybrids can expand into the
performance market.

Mike

com wrote: 

If you can drive like the governmental tests, then you too can achieve
the "advertised" fuel economy ratings. Problem is, most of the
governmental tests (such as the US EPA's) are outdated and don't
accurately reflect the average driver's results. (Manufacturers are
required by law to post the governmental test figures, in at least the
US and UK...) However, since the same test cycle is performed on every
car, then you can use the test results to compare one car against
another...

60 (US) MPG isn't that difficult, if you try for it. Results on my US
2001 and 2004 Prius can be found at:
http://www.kluge.net/~felicity/prius.php

There's always the hypermilers/marathon men, who took a stock US Prius
and drove it 48 hours straight over a 15 mile course, logging 1397
miles and averaging 110 (US) MPG.
http://www.toyota.com/html/hybridsynergyview/2005/fall/marathon.html
http://calcars.org/calcars-news/101.html


A note of warning when quoting foreign car reports - be sure that you
know what test cycle and what type of MPG you are reading about. US or
Imperial MPG? and those different test cycles make a big difference...

You can get some pretty graphs of many of the different tests
here:
http://www.epa.gov/otaq/emisslab/methods/quickdds.htm

US 2005 EPA ratings are 60MPG city, 51MPG highway, 55MPG combined. For
comparison units:
City = 3.9l/100km or 72MPG Imperial or 25.5km/l
Highway = 4.6l/100km or 61MPG Imperial or 21.7km/l
Combined = 4.2l/100km or 66MPG Imperial or 23.4km/l
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/noframes/20934.shtml

Canada 2005 OEE ratings are 71MPG city, 67MPG highway, but that's
Imperial gallons. The ratings are also listed as 4.0l/100km city and
4.2l/100km highway. For comparison units:
City = 59MPG (American) or 25.1km/l
Highway = 56MPG (American) or 23.7km/l
http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/transportation/personal/pdfs/most-efficient-vehicles-2005.pdf

UK 2005 VCA ratings are 56.5MPG urban (cold), 67.3MPG extra urban, and
65.7MPG combined, again Imperial gallons. For comparison units:
urban (cold) = 47MPG (American), or 5.0l/100km urban (cold), or
20.0km/l
extra urban = 56MPG (American), or 4.2l/100km, or 23.8km/l
combined = 55MPG (American), or 4.3l/100km, or 23.3km/l
http://www.vcacarfueldata.org.uk/search/vehicleDetails.asp?id=10982

Japan 2005 using the 10-15 cycle is (if my Japanese translation is
right) 35.5km/l or 33.0km/l depending on option grade. That's
2.8l/100km or 83US MPG or 100 Imperial MPG, and 3.0l/100km or 77 US
MPG or 93.2 Imperial MPG. I do note a OnMouseOver note that's
something about 30.0km/l though...
http://toyota.jp/prius/spec/spec/index.html

BTW: handy online converter site:
http://hemsidor.torget.se/users/b/bohjohan/convert/conv2_e.htm

On 31 Oct 2006 16:35:22 -0800, "com" <com>
wrote:
 

Just a curiosity: When I was a kid, diesel was 1/3 the cost of
regular gasoline. I heard at the time was because diesel didn't need
to be processed as much as gasoline. Now, it is about a dollar more.
What gives? Sticking it to the truckers?

<com> wrote in message
news:com... 

I sure don't know. The price inversion popped up in the 80s, IIRC, when
America turned to diesels for economy (like the diesel Rabbit).

What I don't get is that the price difference compared to gasoline varies so
widely.

Mike

"Michael Pardee" <com> wrote in message
news:net... 

Regular is about $2.25/gallon here right now (Portland, Oregon.) How's that
compare with you people?

In article <com>,
"OscartheGrouch" <com> wrote:
 

Low $2-teens in this Phoenix suburb ($2.099 at Costco), which means that
in some other suburbs and parts of Phoenix, it's below $2.10, and maybe
below $2.00.

Diesel is about 10 to 20 cents higher than High Test around here.

--
Stop Mad Cowboy Disease: Impeach the son of a Bush.

com wrote: 

Methinks you have issues with your Prius. While I've only gotten as
high as 51mpg with mine in the past four months, I know a number of
people who've gotten well over teh "government BS". At least I know why
I don't get the advertised amount, and have proved it to myself.

Your last car probably didn't get the government BS numbers, either

Try hitting some of the Greenhybrid or CleanMPG websites to see how
well people are doing with their hybrids. They get the government BS
numbers; why can't you?